Neutral Application Form

[Jenshey]

Neutrals in the context of Anarchy Online:

• Mercenaries.
• Smugglers.
• Enterprising businesses.
• Suppliers.
• Processing industries.
• ... and mining interest with subcontracting or outright theft.

Motivation:

To increase the profits of Omni-Tek - No.
To actively work against Omni Tek for independence - No.
Self interest, profit, adventure and gain - Yes.

Never heard of a private or mercenary army?

[Mereditche]

Never heard of a private or mercenary army?

Never heard about peacefull civilians?

[Aethyrguard]

Both of these posts below are based primarily on opinion not fact. I am not debating opinion in this thread nor will I. I respect your opinion of what you think it should be but alas it is not. I am simply explaining how it is and that is all.

For Omnitek, "Omni-Med, Omni-Trans, Omni-Mining, Omni-AF, Omni-Pol" are not factions, they are just different services of Omnitek. Med for medical, Trans for transport etc. It is just funny because it is like you say School Bus and American Postal are factions in America. For Clan, Sentinels and Unionist attack Omni at view. I let ppl confirm if Knight of Avalon attack Omni or not. Even if they dont it can be like the Unicorn of the ICC landing pad, it can be just an accord of ceasse fire local and it will not make them become a separated and pacific "faction".

You say "There is about 35% of the original Council of Truth that was considered Pro-Peace, about 15% Undecided" and about 50% Pro-War". This 15% undecided dont have any clear opinion. So it is exact to say the Clan is in war againts Omnitek because the majority have chosen war. And it is not the minority who is representative to say "we are a society of free thinkers". Every society have free thinkers, they can thinking smart things or just thinking idiot things depending of their own intelligence. So when you say "Something Neutrals keep trying to claim as their own identity" is just show the high degre of you knowledge and make you look very smart yourself.

And if it exist some "free thinkers" who start to think "now i have enough to being clan i want to be neutral" can they do that in a "society of free thinkers" ?

I used the term subfactions because it means divisions of a perceived whole. As for omni yes they are Departments. For clans they are entirely different countries which all share a continent and have a council between them. It is an alliance of independent groups of people. In that way Clans already are exactly what 99% of the Neutrals have claimed to be whom cite a concept and or background for themself.

Neutrals in the context of Anarchy Online:

• Mercenaries.
• Smugglers.
• Enterprising businesses.
• Suppliers.
• Processing industries.
• ... and mining interest with subcontracting or outright theft.

Motivation:

To increase the profits of Omni-Tek - No.
To actively work against Omni Tek for independence - No.
Self interest, profit, adventure and gain - Yes.

Never heard of a private or mercenary army?

Everything you posted about what Neutrals are in AO is in fact the definitions belonging to Clan NOT Neutrals. Neutrals are "peaceful civilians resigned from fighting" Funcom's Official stance on the topic. Any one you know that is a Neutral that claims to a self perceived image as you have posted above, please inform them they are on the wrong side. All of those things in your list are what defines Clans you should suggest to them that they seek out to join one if storyline is at all important to them.

It is your opinion that those things define Neutrals. However, those are not the sentiments of the Company which owns the rights to the content you are trying to debate. Their stance is as I have posted here in a citation from the conversation. I am sorry.

[Jenshey]

Clan in the context of Anarchy Online:

• Terrorists.
• Liberation fighters.
• Opposing force to Omni Tek.
• Customers to of Neutrals finished goods.
• Raw produce and materials suppliers.
• ... and mining interests with the belief they are entitled to that land since it is their birth right.

Motivation:

To increase the profits of Omni-Tek - No.
To actively work against Omni Tek for independence - Yes.
Fighting for a cause or ideal - Yes.
Self interest, profit, adventure and gain - No.
Traders between factions - No.

Never heard of a liberation force?

[Aethyrguard]

Clan in the context of Anarchy Online:

• Terrorists.
• Liberation fighters.
• Opposing force to Omni Tek.
• Customers to of Neutrals finished goods.
• Raw produce and materials suppliers.
• ... and mining interests with the belief they are entitled to that land since it is their birth right.

Motivation:

To increase the profits of Omni-Tek - No.
To actively work against Omni Tek for independence - Yes.
Fighting for a cause or ideal - Yes.
Self interest, profit, adventure and gain - No.
Traders between factions - No.

Never heard of a liberation force?

Again this is your opinion. Nothing more. Your first list is Clan so is this that is the point I am trying to make to you. There's already a clan for that. Actually, the Nanomage Liberation Front (player org) and the Dust Brigade (Funcom) are the only real Terrorists on RK.

[Jenshey]

Liberation force driven by ideals != mercenary private army driven by profits.

[huckleberry]

None of the "Omni-Med, Omni-Trans, Omni-Mining, Omni-AF, Omni-Pol" can be called factions, subfaction, surfaction or micro-macro factions. Ppl are not as confused as you think.
For Clan, when the majority have decided to go to war, then ppl can say Clan is in war againts Omnitek. And it is exact.

"In that way Clans already are exactly what 99% of the Neutrals have claimed to be whom cite a concept and or background for themself.". The organization form can look like the same but the ideology can be very different also the affinity. It is something a "society of freethinkers" have to know first before start to thinking...

You are not representative of Funcom and you are a player like others here. You want to say something or debate you can. But ppl dont ask you to change things in the game, they ask Funcom. Maybe you are a friend of Mean or someone of Funcom but it dont mean you can accept or refuse players proposition in their name. When you say "Im sorry" it is a bit survalorization of yourself, isn't it ?

[Notcrattey]

Never heard about peacefull civilians?

so people in the corporation can't be peaceful civilians, living their daily brainwashed lives?

[Shrubberyman]

Ahah, Aethyr was fooled around by a GM and now takes his hope for a reality... Dude, trust me on that, if it's not stated by Means and written in a FwM, it's as good as the old infamous "so, the damage ranking order in game is NTs, then Agents, MAs..."
FC has no interest, none at all, to alienate themselves a part, even a small one, of the remaining player base. Oh, I'm not saying they won't revive a bit the Omni/Clan distinction and specific gear, just that it's highly doubtful it's gonna make the difference you're begging for. If the revival arrives, which I would think a good idea btw, it's not gonna be with the silly magnitude that the Xan boards brought before they were fixed for your servitor's pleasure.

Well, if it was to happen anyway, it will be a great opportunity to have a rematch after the "No gap reducing" campaign failure

[Edta]

Ok, we all had our say about the identity of Neutrals, but this doesn't matter that much for the topic. No matter what a Neutral is: Clomni's should have the right to become Neutral.

[Aethyrguard]

Ahah, Aethyr was fooled around by a GM and now takes his hope for a reality...

No..

Dude, trust me on that, if it's not stated by Means

Yes it was.

and written in a FwM,

Soon. It isn't a main priority right now with all the parts being focused on during the re-balancing act in progress.

As for everything else you wrote since it was based on a lack of information I am just going to move on no harm no foul. As I have said more than once in this thread I am not debating the points. I recently had a chance to have a one-on-one chat with Means and we discussed this as one of the various topics during our conversation. I am merely relaying information as it was explained to me. That is all.

Ok, we all had our say about the identity of Neutrals, but this doesn't matter that much for the topic. No matter what a Neutral is: Clomni's should have the right to become Neutral.

I bumped it in my first post did I not? I just am not fond of watching misinformation spread without stop. It is what got us in this place to begin with and why so many neutrals are not clans, lots of misinformation about what the sides represented. I only entered this topic for two reasons, correct the misinformation since I had first hand knowledge of the answer and it was given in within the last 30 days and to bump the topic. Anyway, I support the change from Clan/Omni to Neutral because, it is supported by the lore first and foremost. Additionally, Someone can start out thinking they want to fight in the game then find friends on all sides and decide the fighting part isn't for them and just take a different more laid back approach and actually start defining out Neutrals as an identity instead of this farce third faction it isn't and will never be. The truly neutral community suffers at the hands of those who claim neutrality as a rebel to the rebels but really belong on one of the two sides. Funny thing that eh? Sad but true.

[Jenshey]

Because the little boy is complaining in the following way:

Firstly changing the contents of peoples quotes is against the forum rules...

I have corrected his quote so that at this point

...

He said not quite passive aggressive but some things that makes me feel disgust none the less.

Happy?

Neutral are here to stay, unless we log in one day and get a message box "Choose a side - Omni or Clan." Then I will just log straight out again, I will not chose and they can get stuffed. Even if a 220 neutral was like a 180 Omni in abilities. I would still stay and go neutral just out of spite if nothing else.

[Aethyrguard]

Neutral are here to stay, unless we log in one day and get a message box "Choose a side - Omni or Clan." Then I will just log straight out again, I will not chose and they can get stuffed. Even if a 220 neutral was like a 180 Omni in abilities. I would still stay and go neutral just out of spite if nothing else.

Firstly changing the contents of peoples quotes is against the forum rules, please correct that. Next, I didn't say they were going anywhere. I said they are going to be given incentives to make a choice. I even stated you couldn't force them to and as for you based on your disinterest in sided content should be fine. You just like to argue for the sake of. I really do think you are just trying to be difficult at this point. I did however, correct you on the error of your view on what the Neutrals as a side represent and what the clans as a side represent. That is not arguable nor passive aggressive. It simply is just a fact.

[BugsCoT]

Never heard about peacefull civilians?

Not in Anarchy Online

[Gatester]

Never heard about peacefull civilians?

Aren't Cyborgs neutrals? Dust-Brigade is too is it not? Even ICC would not exactly be called peaceful civilians.

[Shrubberyman]

As for everything else you wrote since it was based on a lack of information I am just going to move on no harm no foul. As I have said more than once in this thread I am not debating the points. I recently had a chance to have a one-on-one chat with Means and we discussed this as one of the various topics during our conversation. I am merely relaying information as it was explained to me. That is all.

I will be keeping an eye for those events you're foreseeing, in particular since the very same Means himself qualified the change brought to Xan boards as a way to "bridge the gap back to the previous reasonable level". Which brings me to conclude that what we have now is a reasonable power gap. And one I acknowledge as such btw.
I'm all for reviving the Omni/Clan specific identity, in particular if it means specific gear added and storyline/gameplay in line with the old Omni > Clan > Neutral technology theme, but we will have a second round of forum brawl if the actions you're speaking about break again the not-quite-but-not-that-far balance that neutrals just found back against the other sides.

I bumped it in my first post did I not? I just am not fond of watching misinformation spread without stop. It is what got us in this place to begin with and why so many neutrals are not clans, lots of misinformation about what the sides represented. I only entered this topic for two reasons, correct the misinformation since I had first hand knowledge of the answer and it was given in within the last 30 days and to bump the topic. Anyway, I support the change from Clan/Omni to Neutral because, it is supported by the lore first and foremost. Additionally, Someone can start out thinking they want to fight in the game then find friends on all sides and decide the fighting part isn't for them and just take a different more laid back approach and actually start defining out Neutrals as an identity instead of this farce third faction it isn't and will never be. The truly neutral community suffers at the hands of those who claim neutrality as a rebel to the rebels but really belong on one of the two sides. Funny thing that eh? Sad but true.

I'm not fond of the application forms/side switch system, if only because of the way it is exploited by all sides to wear/use gear that wasn't designed for them, but I also agree someone should be entitled to change his loyalties in a fight, or to decide not to have any loyalty after all.
For once (well, twice technically), I also agree with you that the way things have been designed was detrimental to those neutrals that would rather avoid at any cost to have to ally to one or another main side to access content. However, I don't see how FC could fix that situation so long after the damage was done, in particular concerning the numeric representativity and even more so in that context of all-time-low game population.

[Jenshey]

... I did however, correct you on the error of your view on what the Neutrals as a side represent and ...

"A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still."

Don't delude yourself, I stand by what I wrote.

[Edta]

Additionally, Someone can start out thinking they want to fight in the game then find friends on all sides and decide the fighting part isn't for them

So you can't have friends on all sides and still like the fighting part? Those things don't rule each other out you know. I actually fight with friends, against friends. Not to harm them. Just for fun. I pretty much never fight people that don't want to fight. The sickness caused by dying is a disturbing factor: I usually try to avoid it for my opponents, but it also adds a factor of challenge.

I can see that if you fight to harm, you are not really Neutral anymore. I agree that the majority of the pvping Neutrals are not neutral at all; most are Omneuts.

And I get the impression these Omneuts, nor you, nor Means can grasp the nature of real neutrality.

This is a mmorpg: everybody is a fighter, there is no civilians. There is no difference between fighting NPC's or players: both represent people. Neutral NPC's in missions are aggressive too. Even peaceful civilian NPC's like Bartenders or shopkeepers carry a gun and fight back; they don't run of screaming, trying to reach the closest ICC soldier.

So no matter what they are supposed to be, neutrals are not peaceful civilians in AO. Changing this would require a lot of work and the only effect I can see coming from it is pissing of a substantial part of the community.

Neutrals are a beautiful part, flavoring up the nature of AO. They are one of the nice things that makes AO unique and better then other mmorpg's.

(We can built a nice house by now, with all the walls of text in this topic....)

[Jenshey]

Edta, I disagree on the harming part. The motive is not to harm, it is to seize land to turn a handsome profit.

[Edta]

Jenshey, you mean you kill for profit? I'm not saying you belong to a side then, but I can understand Aethyrguard's reasoning against you better. If you kill Clans and get payed for it from OT, what is the difference between an OT employee? Anyway, you're a different neutral and for me you're free to fill in Neutrality as you want . You might want to elaborate yourself a bit more though.

I wanted to bring something else up still.

Notum mining monopoly ends

The ICC declares an end to Omni-Tek's absolute monopoly of notum mining, opening up for all organisations to drill the precious element. The new rules stipulate, however, that Omni-Tek retains its monopoly on off-world distribution of notum.

Rubi-Ka Headline Services
10:00 November 29, 29476 RST

This means all corporations can mine notum. These corporations are concurrents of Omni, so they are not Omni. As far as I know, there currently is no corporate war going on so they can't openly go with Clan either. So they can only belong to Neutral; you'd think there is more neutrals out there then :P.

And thanks for all the bumps this discussion causes! Seems pretty much everybody actually agrees on the actual topic somehow .
And if a moderator person sees this: it could be nice to change the topic name to "Clan/Omni Resignation forms". I bet FC thinks we're still trolling the 220 Neutral-->Clan/Omni application forms if they see the title :P.
(In case it wasn't clear yet, I'm OP on different account ).