Changes to Perk targeting and effect on Agents

[Muskee]

Emos!

[Lupusceleri]

Emos!

Nice necro.

But this problem is still in place, two as of late useless perks.

[topa_boss]

another pvp aimed fix that will hurt the actually important part of ao: pvm

at least it will hurt shades the most, woot

[Shiekah]

It's not really 'think' its more we know you are statistically the best performing PVP profession by some margin. Its not even ambiguous or open to interpretation. On a profession by profession basis Agents top every measurable when it comes to PVP, most importantly the number of people they kill. This is especially impressive when considered relative to the percentage of the player-base that agents make up. Statistically there is not a profession even all that close to matching the killing power of agents in the actual PVP that occurs on the servers.

If Agents are the best PvP profession in the game then may I ask what you would consider to be the profession that would need the most work on in PvP? Theres 1 particular profession that I can think of that is currently the best at Dying and the worst at killing. In answering this question, could you please also add when it may be that this 'worst profession' will obtain what it needs to become equal with everyone else? Chances are I wont get a reply from this... as I never do.

[lizor]

Theres 1 particular profession that I can think of that is currently the best at Dying and the worst at killing.

and its not shades. =)

[vaskin]

and its not shades. =)

Sirlion yu cant understand that agents, nice pvpers on tl5 only atm.....
tl7:
I have best setup ingame, evades,3 k ,AR 3 k NR etc....but i can nothing already as ppl got too many evades, debuffs ,hp. I dont want to kill gimps, noobs only!!

P.S^ Pre-LE was perfect time .... Nerf us more!!!

[Hacre]

Sirlion yu cant understand that agents, nice pvpers on tl5 only atm.....
tl7:
I have best setup ingame, evades,3 k ,AR 3 k NR etc....but i can nothing already as ppl got too many evades, debuffs ,hp. I dont want to kill gimps, noobs only!!

P.S^ Pre-LE was perfect time .... Nerf us more!!!

You've chosen to perk NR, which I am sure nerfs your offense somewhat.

There's better agents than you, yet to be honest, your kills and that Master title you were carrying around which you claim is legit, would say Agents are just fine.

[Biggysmallz]

If Agents are the best PvP profession in the game then may I ask what you would consider to be the profession that would need the most work on in PvP? Theres 1 particular profession that I can think of that is currently the best at Dying and the worst at killing. In answering this question, could you please also add when it may be that this 'worst profession' will obtain what it needs to become equal with everyone else? Chances are I wont get a reply from this... as I never do.

Speaks Champion Shade, rofl

You've chosen to perk NR, which I am sure nerfs your offense somewhat.

There's better agents than you, yet to be honest, your kills and that Master title you were carrying around which you claim is legit, would say Agents are just fine.

Well NR doesn't really gimp offense.

[kiggity]

i bet NR makes UBT unlandable on some profs

[Biggysmallz]

i bet NR makes UBT unlandable on some profs

does it affect offense?

[vaskin]

You've chosen to perk NR, which I am sure nerfs your offense somewhat.

There's better agents than you, yet to be honest, your kills and that Master title you were carrying around which you claim is legit, would say Agents are just fine.

3k AR isnt enought? 90% agents with 2700-2800 AR!

[Berserkmc]

You've chosen to perk NR, which I am sure nerfs your offense somewhat.

You're wrong. It's just nerf our ability to use our high-req SL procs, but they have no use in Mass-PvP and in BS. ~3k AR w/o any sacrfices in def it's actually one of the best numbers for agent. Actually most of the battle profesions have 3300 AR easy and some support have 2850-2900 and huge passive defences at same time(except maybe shades and MA).

But only agents have 2 unique defences in this game - small scale and very high concealment. So looks like all of you, who tell us agents about our uberness and your gimpness just want to get same ability - will be in conceal most of your time... I see many other professions in sneak on BS, but most of them "tried to hide but failed..."

Last time on BS i see keepers, enforcers, doctors, engineers and soldiers tanking 5+ not bad peoples from 1 to 3 minutes. If i'll try to do same, i'm see decon room after 5 to 10 seconds. Pre-17.8 i have a chance to kill someone for that time, now i can just die, or hit AS in 30% target to help my side, or sit in conceal and wait easy target or any gimp, who have no skill.

Sil, you should choose, what role we have in PvP - snipers with no passive defence, but huge sneak alphastrike, or we should stay with moderate offence but get some passive defence to survive some more time. I'm prefer 1st, that was pre-17.8.

And dont tell me about CH, it's not passive defence and can be countered if you have just a 1/4 of brain.

P.S. Thanks for having a chance for us be useful in new DB instance, i'm already forgot, how it can be an agent and replace some profs...

[Hacre]

You're wrong. It's just nerf our ability to use our high-req SL procs, but they have no use in Mass-PvP and in BS. ~3k AR w/o any sacrfices in def it's actually one of the best numbers for agent. Actually most of the battle profesions have 3300 AR easy and some support have 2850-2900 and huge passive defences at same time(except maybe shades and MA).

But only agents have 2 unique defences in this game - small scale and very high concealment. So looks like all of you, who tell us agents about our uberness and your gimpness just want to get same ability - will be in conceal most of your time... I see many other professions in sneak on BS, but most of them "tried to hide but failed..."

Last time on BS i see keepers, enforcers, doctors, engineers and soldiers tanking 5+ not bad peoples from 1 to 3 minutes. If i'll try to do same, i'm see decon room after 5 to 10 seconds. Pre-17.8 i have a chance to kill someone for that time, now i can just die, or hit AS in 30% target to help my side, or sit in conceal and wait easy target or any gimp, who have no skill.

Sil, you should choose, what role we have in PvP - snipers with no passive defence, but huge sneak alphastrike, or we should stay with moderate offence but get some passive defence to survive some more time. I'm prefer 1st, that was pre-17.8.

And dont tell me about CH, it's not passive defence and can be countered if you have just a 1/4 of brain.

P.S. Thanks for having a chance for us be useful in new DB instance, i'm already forgot, how it can be an agent and replace some profs...

Then you need to L2P. The good agents are still as deadly as they always were, because they learned to adapt.

[Ebondevil]

Then you need to L2P. The good agents are still as deadly as they always were, because they learned to adapt.

Which can also be translated as make sure you have all the best gear available, including billions worth of Combined armour and gimp yourself for PvM...

[Hacre]

Which can also be translated as make sure you have all the best gear available, including billions worth of Combined armour and gimp yourself for PvM...

Sometimes the best PvP setups are not conducive to PvM success as well. Agents are not alone in that regard.

Nor are you alone in the best PvP setup requiring billions worth of gear.

But please do go on about how Agents are nerfest.

[Berserkmc]

But please do go on about how Agents are nerfest.

Looks like keepers are nerfest now... Words of man who played with keeper and NT after they got triples. I can speak with you after you get an 220 lvl agent, nvm, PvP or PvM. Nice to see when keeper talking about agent capabilities.

Even if agent got many billions setup, like Vasich, he still can't tank 5+ well-equipped peoples, like keeper or sold can, because agent have no tanking capabilites except CH. Fyi, if agent choose not to perk NR1 or NR2, they have ~1900 NR with best NR twinking gear w/o gimping offence or other defence. I think only gimps casters have such low nanoskills.
Pre-17.8 we can use our alpha for doing huge damage to our target from sneak and then try to finish our target and run out before get debuffed and killed. Huge offence was compensate to almost 0 passive defence(CH is countered atm with various debuffs, from RI to GTH, and stuns). Atm we have alpha nerfed and defence capabilities same.

Anyway, nice to see, how some of non-agents whine and troll all of our threads, and we still adapt and looking a way to use our out-of-date setups and crap weapons to pwn all of the whiners.

[Blackcradle]

Sometimes the best PvP setups are not conducive to PvM success as well. Agents are not alone in that regard.

No we are not alone in that regard, but the sacrifices we make are marginally greater than everyone elses, and it gimps our PvM capability far more than the sacrifices other profs have to make. MAs, Shades, Solds, Keepers, Engis, et. all, can perform fine if not better than fine in PvM in a pvp setup, way better than an agent. Even more-so after the latest changes. So I would hardly call your comparison fair.

[Yue]

while that's indeed true a pvm setup ma does far worse than a pvm setup agent in pvp.

anyway that pvm vs. pvp argument is tiresome and doesn't really add to anything. dunno why ppl always feel like breaking it up.

[Hacre]

Looks like keepers are nerfest now... Words of man who played with keeper and NT after they got triples. I can speak with you after you get an 220 lvl agent, nvm, PvP or PvM. Nice to see when keeper talking about agent capabilities.

I don't need to play an Agent to know how well they perform in PvP. You're also an idiot if you think I didn't play my NT pre LE.

Even if agent got many billions setup, like Vasich, he still can't tank 5+ well-equipped peoples, like keeper or sold can, because agent have no tanking capabilites except CH.

That's because you're not a tank class, unlike soldiers and keepers. It also largely depends on who those 5+ well equipped people are for the keeper or soldier.

Fyi, if agent choose not to perk NR1 or NR2, they have ~1900 NR with best NR twinking gear w/o gimping offence or other defence.

My keeper has ~2k NR if I wear all the NR gear I possess. Unlike Agents I can't easily pop two perks into NR.

Pre-17.8 we can use our alpha for doing huge damage to our target from sneak and then try to finish our target and run out before get debuffed and killed. Huge offence was compensate to almost 0 passive defence(CH is countered atm with various debuffs, from RI to GTH, and stuns). Atm we have alpha nerfed and defence capabilities same.

I've already gone on record to say that nerfs of any kind are bad. People like you, who refuse to acknowledge nerfs to other professions and only cry about your own however, invite little sympathy/support from the rest of the community. I certainly don't see an agent now and think "Oh no problem, that one perk he could hit me from sneak with isn't an issue anymore so I can just ignore him".

Anyway, nice to see, how some of non-agents whine and troll all of our threads, and we still adapt and looking a way to use our out-of-date setups and crap weapons to pwn all of the whiners.

Welcome to the world of Keepers and NTs, who's threads have been pissed all over by non keepers/NTs for years. Quick clue, if you're whining about how nerfed you are and the entire community spits masses of hate in your direction, chances are, you're not that nerfest.

No we are not alone in that regard, but the sacrifices we make are marginally greater than everyone elses, and it gimps our PvM capability far more than the sacrifices other profs have to make. MAs, Shades, Solds, Keepers, Engis, et. all, can perform fine if not better than fine in PvM in a pvp setup, way better than an agent. Even more-so after the latest changes. So I would hardly call your comparison fair.

For a shade to do well at all in PvP they either need to be trox and spend 10 perks for MR and be a melee version of an agent spending most of their time in sneak without any kind of range advantage, or spend 8 perks in NR and only appear from sneak when acrobat is up. The latter certainly sounds like a big PVM nerf to me, bigger than anything agents have to endure.

Pretty sure there's plenty of PVP Engineers that would beg to differ as well about how "well" they do in PVM.

EDIT: What Yue said. Same applies for PvM shades.

[Berserkmc]

You're also an idiot if you think I didn't play my NT pre LE.

Well, you can play it even pre-LE, but level it up after LE came up, and i dont know, do you just like NT's or just like NT with triples.

That's because you're not a tank class, unlike soldiers and keepers.

Well, role of my class pre-SL was false profession support, so i can replace most of the prof at 50-75% eff. And atm that role is forgotten, after SL came and our role should be(from FC's view) a "best-DD-ranged class", and we get our SL-procs(will be broken until LE release) and 3 lines of DD perks(we have not single one def perk).
If i'm not tank class, maybe you can answer me, what type of class i am? I think you can't. Because even Funcom's crew cant answer us, and ignore us most of the time. I'm agree, some of ideas is stupid and imbalanced, but how about just get some useful fixes(fixing proc on rifle that noone use now is really help ) and revamps, or just get us an answer - what role of our class in this game?

My keeper has ~2k NR if I wear all the NR gear I possess.

Good, do you have any nanos you should use in combat and if you cant use it under debuff you will die in 1s? And we can't easy pop perks to NR2, it's major sacrifice and risk. Procs do not check NR also, but it's not only agent problem(but actually keepers does not suffer from NSD or drain procs).

People like you, who refuse to acknowledge nerfs to other professions and only cry about your own however, invite little sympathy/support from the rest of the community.

Well, why i should look at them if they can do it by themselves? I see shades and MA suffering now, like most of support profs was in black hole and be ignored before LE. I dont like, when FC ignores them too, but i'm not play with these professions, why i should think about them? Some of them have their own professionals and players, so i think they can speak about own problems. I'm speaking about agent's problems.

Welcome to the world of Keepers and NTs, who's threads have been pissed all over by non keepers/NTs for years.

Well, i'm not sure about agents trolling any profs threads, but i'm personally not looking in other profession threads and forums. But i see some fixers trolling in our threads much time, dunno, maybe they troll at keepers too.
And i'm not a whining, i'm just speak about what i dont like and just want to know what role FC want for agents. I can agree with having useless crap, until we have balance of profession untoched. Atm balance is broken, and i dont like that. Ofc i can stuck with killing gimps and greens or just hide in sneak and be a "small running aimedshot each 12s" but i'm not use "AS/zoning" playstyle before and dont want use it now.